Response of Minister Paolo Ferrero on Immigration


Minister Paolo Ferrero has sent a letter in response to the post “Immigration is Taboo”.

“Dear Grillo,
I’ve seen that you define me as irresponsible on your Blog. I think that this is a mistaken accusation. Each year, tens of thousands of people enter Italy illegally and dozens die in the Strait of Sicily.
I think that we need to understand how to avoid these deaths and this suffering and this is why we must take note that currently Italy, that has seen our grandparents leaving (almost 30 million emigrated) has now become a country of immigration. The sooner we recognises this the better we can face up to the problem in a way that is not demagogic.

In the 2000 keystrokes available I am keen to underline 3 priorities:

1) It is necessary to decidedly increase the help given by “developed” countries to poor countries, to construct serious cooperation – like Italy and Europe – to promote social and economic development starting with North Africa.

2) It’s necessary to go beyond the Bossi Fini law because this law essentially makes it impossible for immigrants to enter Italy legally and it obliges them to be clandestines and to become the prey of criminals who organise people trafficking. In fact today, to enter Italy legally it’s necessary that an Italian employer makes a named request for a person in that person’s country of origin. It never happens like that because the employers first want to know the people before taking them on.

3) It’s necessary to have a decisive battle with the criminals that organise people trafficking.
To act and to fight to remove the causes of inequality at a world level does not exempt us from trying to regularise what is now happening in secret. To treat migrants as people and not as merchandise and to guarantee that they have civil rights are conditions that will also prevent them from being used as low cost labour and so that they, too, can justly fight against the exploitation and injustice of this world. With unchanged esteem.

Paolo Ferrero Minister of Social Solidarity.

Posted by Beppe Grillo at 10:00 PM in | Comments (17)
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Response regarding The Minister of Social Solidarity Paolo Ferrero's comment on changes in the immigration laws. Particular interest in his second point.

2) It’s necessary to go beyond the Bossi Fini law because this law essentially makes it impossible for immigrants to enter Italy legally and it obliges them to be clandestines and to become the prey of criminals who organise people trafficking. In fact today, to enter Italy legally it’s necessary that an Italian employer makes a named request for a person in that person’s country of origin. It never happens like that because the employers first want to know the people before taking them on.

You are absolutely correct. However, tell me why then, an immigrant comes with an offer of work and for two years permits were denied. First year out of quota. Second year, never received a response. Tell me how a person can contribute to paying inps and taxes with an "official" codice fiscal, have a rental contract, pay all utilities in that persons name and not be able to receive a resident permit. Yet, in March, thousands applied to receive resident permits. How in the world can the documents for 500,000 plus immigrant applications be verified that infact, they have work or an offer of, and accommodations? Please explain to me why no one knows the exact process for obtaining the correct paperwork? The Italian consulate abroad say do it there, "we don't know", and here they say, "do it there, we don't know". But yet now, a person after 5 years can receive a resident permit. The information is contradictive. I am frustrated by the fact, that I am increasing the skills of Italians to better themselves, I pay taxes and I can't get the proper documents, buy a car, or utilize health care that I have paid into!

Posted by: ppalmer | September 16, 2006 03:49 PM

Joselle we are saying the same thing,do not forget we are the one who vote ours politians,ciao:-)

Posted by: evakulnura | September 2, 2006 10:14 AM

Well Eva, the world would be quite okay really had we first, at the very roots of our democracy, genuine leaders who REALLY would strive for a better world. As things are, I still have to see an honest, disinterested, altruistic, genuine and unselfish politician.

Yes Raffaella, I know about the LRA and similiar guerilla bands in many African countries. You have to remember, also, that in most African countries, the rule of the tribe supersedes any democracy. It is this same rule that brought so many killings in Burundi, for example. But here lies all the hypocrisy of many governments [and I mean MOST European and US governments]... they all stand to count what they are going to gain if they had to help in a real, just way. In the end, the ditto of most seems to be, "if I can't lay my hands on something, then to hell with help."

BUT, and this is the crux of the matter, while most UN organizational groups complain, it appears the the UNO is inane in front of all this devastation because, at its roots, the UNO is managed by politicians... AND POLITICS ARE DIRTY GAMES... and to conclude, I have no trust of Anan and his henchmen.

And many private organizations are frustrated because nothing is done concretely to bring stability in famine stricken and tribal war torn countries... what we often call Civil War in Africa springs from the age old territory extensions and suction of little tribes by bigger ones in most African culture. We do not accept this because our vision of life is broader and we have long given up the idea of a chieftain and his settlers. Yet it is a reality elsewhere and most Western governments not only did not batter an eyelid, they just took this situation to their advantage. Think of how a great country like India got dominated, for example, or South Africa, or Congo...

We Europeans so called civilizers have been so outrightly uncivilized ourselves by not being able to provide a solid education to the people our countries have colonized. Instead we have contributed more to their poverty...

But all in due time, one day, may be, the Third World countries might just be able to do that thing they want so much to be able to do... kick us in the ass and tell us to go get ourselves a coffee...

Thanks so much, oh civilized Western world...

Posted by: Joselle Camilleri | September 2, 2006 09:12 AM

Joselle and Raf,the ball is back in our court,you both make a good point,and I agree with you 100%,the western world,and we have to realise that we play a big part in what's happening,we can't go on with a blind eye pretending it doesn't have anything to do with us,we created the problem in the first place!ciao :-)

Posted by: evakulnura | August 26, 2006 12:13 AM

Joselle: the countries which are giving help and money to the underdeveloped countries, in the same time are selling weapons to them or supporting the various wars in the same countries they are helping. I was in Africa and I saw with my eyes that many countries, like Uganda e.g., wouldn't be so poor without civil war. In Uganda there is a very generous soil and a wonderful climate. They have a lot of agriculture and cattle, drought and famine are unknown. But there is a civil war, against a little but very aggresive group called "Lord Resistence Army", who are slaughtering and terrorising entire villages in the north of the country. This population had to flee and take refuge in refugee camps. They haven't anything more and because of this is this region reduced to poverty .
The government seems to do something, but nothing happened. The reason? I spoke with friends of mine who are working there, by the UN refugee commission. The most Great Powers (USA, UK) and other industrialized countries are giving their support to the government on condition that it doesn't permit the penetration of Islamic fundamentalistic groups in the country. As this terrosistic group is christian (The "lord" is the christian god!!!!)isn't so important. They can go on terrorizing the population, killing children ad reducing them to slaves.
As you see, the balance in the third world is not so easy.

Posted by: Raffaella Biferale | August 25, 2006 08:46 PM

To start with, as long as there is war, famine, pain and suffering, you are going to find people desperate enough to flee their situation and find their luck elsewhere.

The trouble with what we call Third World Countries is that rich countries hardly care a fig. Hundreds of years ago all that Europe did was simply to colonize the "brutes" [not my words, you will find them in the poems of Tennyson et al. during the years of colonization]. This said, what happened? Practically that the rich got richer and the poor got poorer. The resources some African countries have end up being exploited by the puppet/dictatorial/despot governments who have no SERIOUS intention of helping their own people. And the West looks on without flinching.

Marcia is right saying that corruption stinks at all ends. There is also another factor to keep in mind. Immigrants do not come here just for fun. Behind this mass immigration, clandestine or not, these poor souls are convinced of entering a kind of a bargain. They pay unscrupulous lousy bastards [some are even European], they are stripped of their blood and sweat money, thrown in the sea when close to the shore and left to their destiny.

You say that in other countries a number of laws and counter measures are taken to ensure whether an immigrant should be allowed to stay or not. In my opinion, Italy is considered a safer place to land for many reasons, not merely the short distance from some North African countries, but also the long coastline, the possibility of "disappearing" literally because of the inadequacy of the situation at the moment, and then, quite conveniently, because of its frontiers, people can travel practically unhindered into other countries because of the open borders.

It would be better if the government gave a tax relief or rebate to those families who could, with a few Euros a week, maintain a family in its own environment, much like adopting at a distance... instead of adopting one child, you adopt a child and its family, why not? And the government should refund you a full tax rebate for that... after all, you are making your country a better place, and saving important money that can go elsewhere to help these people, perhaps teach them something useful for life, a skill, an education...

Give a man a fish today and he will be hungry tomorrow... teach a man fishing and he will have food everyday... or something like that.

Posted by: Joselle Camilleri | August 25, 2006 04:23 PM

Edmond, you are right, we must help those people in their countries, but... this is a long and difficult process. To help directly is not enough, we as industrialized conutries must also stop to take advantage of them, for example paying the right price for their goods, and not to subsidize the civil wars in those countries, otherwise our help is vain.
In the meantime those people will come to us, and we can't stop this trend.

Posted by: Raffaella Biferale | August 25, 2006 11:49 AM

In order to become a permanent resident in Canada I had:
- medical examinations
- financial investigation
- criminal records investigations
- English & French language test
- working history examinations
... then after two years I have been approved !!

For some reason, if Italy just think of approaching any of these test for Immigrants, it is considered RACIAL DISCRIMINATION.

Spain sink the boats, Greece shoot at them, Denmark & Holland test them, Germany closed the doors, France can't deal with them, but
Hey, Italy Can't !!!
We have been defined the Official Docking Territory.

Helping them at home, Giving them the same working conditions, Giving them rights is the right approach. But they have to adapt themselves to the new country as all the immigrants do in the rest of the world !!

We gotta change PM !!!

Posted by: Edmondo D. | August 25, 2006 05:43 AM

He has completely missed the point in his reply.
Problem is not (or at least it is not only) people coming more or less illegally. This is not an issue to be discussed further.
Problem is making jobs defined now as "not suitable to Italian people" to become suitable. Problem is making sure small, medium and big companies recruit people offering the right compensation and the right assurance regarding safety and future and all the basic rights. And all the stuff we Italians are going to find elsewhere abroad.
But of course this is not enough "spectacular" to hit newspapers coverage.

Posted by: Massimiliano Gerardi | August 24, 2006 02:31 PM

Paolo Ferrero Minister of Social Solidarity.

Just get out of North Africa (You will just have to get your gas from "civilised democratic christain countries who have "your higher western culture".
I guess you will have to pander to whims of putin and his idea of DEMOCKERY which after all is the same as yours only you spell it Democracy.

What North African countries need is not your values or your democracy under the guise of libral market of your resources at our prices, it does not need "colonialisation" financial or economic under the World Bank and above all it does not need your racist trade agreement with DEmocracy input. Treat Africa the same as you treat your chosen group.

And above all stop interferring in the electroral system by vote rigging and putting your slaves to govern for you by proxy.

While you are at it stop nominating that facist UN security council. All Italian MPs sing about UN without having the foggist idea what UN security council political agenda is.

I find it chilling that an Italian MP has the audacity to talk about "deaths and this suffering".

Where were all the Italian MPs, clergy and the rest of the loud mouth at the massacres of "Qana" major part women & children.

Major part of the Italian government was acting as a cheerleader & war pimps to the Israeli indiscriminate bombing of disabled children, women, men.

If being given the right to right on Beppe Grillo's blog is democracy than you have a long way to go before you understand real Democracy: the democracy that His Excellency Ayatoallah Ali Al Sistani taught the moron who used some fancy title, the fraudster and embezzler Bremer in Irak.

Democracy is one men one vote with no ballot boxes arriving from stateside or UK

Posted by: Marcia Visanji | August 24, 2006 10:01 AM

I agree with Giovanni,

He thinks to have a bunch of sheeps....
Who does want to see other people suffer, or see criminal organisation getting stonger?

Less words but concise goals, the rethorical issues should not be life style: this is the main problems with the politicians (especially in Italy).

Posted by: gabriele | August 24, 2006 09:25 AM

So you have got an Italian minister to reply! Now that must count for something. when have Italian MPs ever bothered to act or reply? An Italian MP thinks it is part of job not to reply. Other countries hold surgeries whereby you can contact your MP but in Italy you would have to pay extremely well to listen to you.

The only time an Italian MP reponds or replies is when it concerne their chosen people.

Only when the it concerns the jews!

I have written to Rutelli, Veltroni, ...... I have not received a single reply.

I have written to the Mayor of London and have received a reply to all my mails. Before the new government in Canada I received a reply from them

Perhaps the minister should remember who pays their wages!

Posted by: Marcia Visanji | August 24, 2006 08:27 AM

fab tom, because they just let entry only what they need,some country have policy in place,and are very stright about,like australia,is also easy for us because is hard to come here illigally,but belive it or not the one that do not want more immigrant in the country,are the immigrants themself,isn't this funny!

Posted by: evakulnura | August 24, 2006 06:08 AM

but then, why in other countries the immigration laws work perfectly?? why?

Posted by: fab tom | August 24, 2006 03:05 AM

The abrogation of the ignoble Bossi-Fini law can't be delayed. I hope that will happen as soon as possible, together with the abrogation of the Biagi law and promulgation of the interest-conflict law.
The new governemnt should have these three priorities...

Posted by: Raffaella Biferale | August 24, 2006 02:09 AM

Maybe he's thinking that is dealing with a bunch of sheeps here.

Mr. Ferrero! What do you think about the Emigration problem?
Can you add a couple of lines to your letter to explain this?

Also, can you contribute to ease the Bossi-Fini's law to relax this situation?

Posted by: Giovanni Principe | August 23, 2006 11:27 PM

Notice that the employee Ferrero ignored Beppe's point that Italy still is a land of emigration, with so many educated Italians leaving to find work abroad.

Posted by: George De Stefano | August 23, 2006 11:21 PM

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